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Is the river really drying up? Last viewed: 2 seconds ago

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Scott,

Your comments here hit the nail right on the head. Reading through this thread, I was thinking the same things...

I for one got into this as a "supplement" to my income out of necessity. I got laid off my manufacturing management job and now make half of what I used to! BUT it is something I really ENJOY doing, so if you love your job, you're not at "work," right?

I have found that working with vintage drums has led me to a market I hadn't even thought of 2 years ago: schools! And I've found that rebuilding/refurbishing/restoring (whatever you'd like to call it!) marching drums is just as enjoyable!

And not only that, but there IS a market for the entry-level drums as well, as just this summer I've moved 3 of those types: 1 no-name MIJ, 1 Verve (MIT), and 1 Ludwig Accent (MIT), all of which got just as much attention as the vintage sets I've worked on. Got some similar projects lined up as well.

So, sorry if this is offensive to some, but I'm a proud RESELLER. I don't try to gouge anyone, just try to get enough to keep things going...

BTW -- scroll to the bottom of this post, and I've attached a photo of our local HS's drum line that I recently finished. This has led to another similar job at one of our state's 2 year colleges, and hopefully will lead to more!

Bill

From tnsquint

This is an interesting thread and the comments here range from logical to passionate. I think as buyers we often expect too much from sellers, specifically on CL. Many of those items are just things people are moving to avoid throwing out. A case in point would be the $40 tom in Tennessee. While that drum meant something importnat to our VDF friend, to the seller, it was probably just an item that needed to go away for the cost of half of a tank of gas. Probably not very high on their radar. By the time you have the husband and wife both involved there is bound to be miscommunication. Most of these people are not professional resellers. (If they were, they should be charging sales tax when applicable). For many people, cash in hand is better than turning away someone on the hope that the guy on the phone earlier will honor his word. For my part, I try very hard to keep track of who called first, who said what and then honoring my word. Interestingly enough that can be difficult with people leaving limited information in messages. Again, this is not a full time job for most people. As to the Christian way to do things, my Bible says "simply let your yes be a yes and your no be a no.". Not so hard really. Offer me an extra Benjamin after I have already agreed to a deal and I say no. My fault for not asking enough. One thing I at least try to do is get a pending deal with a buyer. Basically I ask him to agree that he/she will purchase at the agreed price pending inspection. I don't want a buyer to feel obligated once they see the item, but I am not running a showroom either. Lastly, there seems to be a lot of antagonism at the thought that one might purchase an item at a low price with the plan to sell it at a higher price. I understand that this is a passion for us, but for some, they have turned their passion into a career, or at least supplemental income. Instead of vilifying them, let's consider applauding someone who found something they loved to do and figured out how to get paid doing it. That is the beautiful part of capitalism. Personnally I say congratulations to all of you who do so. For those of you who don't agree, just buy somewhere else but please do no berate the entrepreneurial spirit. ...on the other hand there is Pooder, but that just comes with the territory. As always, vote with your dollars.

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Bill
Cherryvale, Ks
"Redrums - Ks" on FB and Reverb
(also "billnvick" on eBay)
Posted on 12 years ago
#41
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From billnvick

Scott,Your comments here hit the nail right on the head. Reading through this thread, I was thinking the same things...I for one got into this as a "supplement" to my income out of necessity. I got laid off my manufacturing management job and now make half of what I used to! BUT it is something I really ENJOY doing, so if you love your job, you're not at "work," right?I have found that working with vintage drums has led me to a market I hadn't even thought of 2 years ago: schools! And I've found that rebuilding/refurbishing/restoring (whatever you'd like to call it!) marching drums is just as enjoyable!And not only that, but there IS a market for the entry-level drums as well, as just this summer I've moved 3 of those types: 1 no-name MIJ, 1 Verve (MIT), and 1 Ludwig Accent (MIT), all of which got just as much attention as the vintage sets I've worked on. Got some similar projects lined up as well.So, sorry if this is offensive to some, but I'm a proud RESELLER. I don't try to gouge anyone, just try to get enough to keep things going...BTW -- scroll to the bottom of this post, and I've attached a photo of our local HS's drum line that I recently finished. This has led to another similar job at one of our state's 2 year colleges, and hopefully will lead to more!Bill

Thats good work being done there.

Rogers Drums Big R era 1975-1984 Dating Guide.
http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=24048
Posted on 12 years ago
#42
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Bill, I am indeed a fan.

I don't want to turn this thread into something political, but capitalism seems to be getting a black eye these days. Why is so hard to comprehend that people like to be compensated for work. Just because this is a hobby to some (myself included) that does not mean we should project that sentiment on others. To some it appears that resellers are gouging when they buy kits to restore or simply flip.

People like to be compensated for their efforts. There are plenty of guys on this forum that give stuff away or for next to nothing. Most of those guys view this as a labour of love or as a hobby so profits don't really enter into the equation. I love those guys and they too should be generously applauded. On the other hand, there are plenty of guys that do view this as a form of income. I would rather buy from them as we at least have some sort of pseudo relationship than an unknown seller. In the process I get to feel like I have possibly helped them out as well while getting what I wanted. I cannot fathom that there is anything wrong with that.

As to Bill, he does resell for profit as well he should. He is also a kind a generous soul who sold three shells to me for a project for a friend. Between the time we spent on the phone, the time he spent packaging and shipping and the pittance he charged me, I would imagine he would have to view that tranaction as a loss. I, for one, greatly appreciate that.

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 12 years ago
#43
Posts: 6524 Threads: 37
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Ask a question,...Get an answer !!

Isn`t that what this site is all about ?

We have a for sale section, for show section, general topic section, cymbal section,...you get the idea,...and that`s just it,..the idea !! I suppose that all the copycat sites pop`n up have been through here, talked in here, and wish they were here as in this site. (sorry Pink Floyd) Well, we don`t need no education, we don`t need no price listings, no page after page of what should be what, People in buisness should leave us alone,.but hey, people, smoke yourself a bone !! All we want is just our,.. sticks and a throne !!

You buisness people and website creators come on buy all you like,...just don`t cry when the drumming drowns out the vocals !!

It`s a drum,.....Hit It !!

.....76/#XK9207 Phonic Sound Machine D454/D-505 snares !i
Posted on 12 years ago
#44
Posts: 6524 Threads: 37
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Sorry bout the rant, my FT wrote that, it get`s wild every now and again and I`m forced to beat on it !!

It`s a drum,.....Hit It !!

.....76/#XK9207 Phonic Sound Machine D454/D-505 snares !i
Posted on 12 years ago
#45
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I am sitting on two sets of Rogers right now I will be selling. On the one set, I am upside down. On the other, I have profit room that will make me do a little better than break even between the two. For those who buy to resale on a regular basis, or whose primary/secondary source of income depends on resale at profit, I respect that the margin for profit/loss/breakeven is small, and undependable.

I also understand the POV in the original posting. A seller committed to a price, and then, without regard for the deal, made another. That probably means that whatever else happened that week for the OP, the bottom line was reduced to either a loss or a break even if he was lucky. Ethically, if one agrees to a buy or a sell, then that person is morally committed to the deal as made. Period. At least that is my opinion.

I recently drove an hour and a half one way to buy a set I had spoken with the seller on the phone, believed I had a good unseen idea of the condition on the set, and was prepared to buy upon arrival. What I found was nothing like described. Upon first seeing the set, my initial reaction was to turn around and just drive off. Some peoples idea of "good condition" is my idea of ... break out the lighter fluid and matches.

I dont quite understand the resentment towards business sellers or buying/flipping for profit. No one is independently wealthy enough to buy everything to give away, no matter what degree "labor of love" emotional BS is involved.

I do resent those whose first posts are in the "for sale" section, and thats the only place you see their presence. I look at those as users rather than contributors.

Rogers Drums Big R era 1975-1984 Dating Guide.
http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=24048
Posted on 12 years ago
#46
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I fall into the category of someone who used to flip sets. The main reason I did was because I wanted to get a chance to play around with various sets and get to know what made them tick. Sure, I'd make a profit on some, but I'd take losses on others. Ultimately, I came out ahead because I gained the knowledge of what kits from various manufacturers sound like and how they function live and in the studio.

Now, I don't feel the pressing need to buy/sell, especially since the used market is so flooded with wheeler-dealers, and it's frustrating to deal with them. It's especially amazing to see a bunch of people on craigslist who have "a little information", and we all know what that leads to...

1970 Ludwig Downbeat
1965 Ludwig Hollywood
1970 Ludwig Jazzette
Posted on 12 years ago
#47
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