I would think, prior to the Beatles the manufacturing of drums were a lot more date and component accurate ? A lot of drum companies were either out of or going out of business, once Ed Sullivan said the Beatles, the manufacturer landscape changed, companies like Rogers and Ludwig couldn't keep up to the demand from what I have read, I doubt there was much thought in what was old stock and what was new pertaining to the label inside the drum, fill the orders and get them out the door.

I don't think they gave much thought to us drum nerds and what we would consider accurate 50-60 years later. I wish they had (ha ha) !

I will add this, I like the bow tie t-rods so I changed mine, from the flat t-rods the next care taker of my kit can change them to suit his taste.

I purchased the rods and claws shown in the picture. Thanks, all.

For a few years now, I've been trying to document when all these hardware and shell changes occurred for Rogers, but as all Rogers guys know, those changes don't really correspond perfectly to serial numbers (which were pulled and applied almost randomly). I've based my estimates for changes on observations of actual factory-original drums displayed on this site and others.

This issue of bass T-rods is especially confusing, as the 1966/67 transition period saw a lot of changes (Faucet to flat T-rods, Dog-Bone tom mount to the newer Swivo mount, "blips" or shoulders appear on the square heads of tension rods, twisted guards on the Dynasonic become "fold-over", Dynasonic shells go from 7-line to 5-line, etc, etc, etc.) So I've seen Holiday basses in the 68xxx Dayton range with factory-original flat T-rods, yet (as Rims points out) "later" 70xxx serial numbers with faucets! Obviously, the 68xxx bass with flat T-rods is actually "newer" than the 70xxx with faucets.

Compounding the confusion caused by workers applying random labels at the factory, individual 1966 shells could sit in the warehouse and not be assembled until 1967. Precise, year-of-manufacture dating for Rogers is an estimate at best. Here are some actual Holiday label observations of transitions:

Highest B&B lug Holiday observed - #35327 Cleveland

Lowest Beavertail Holiday observed- #36131 Cleveland

(so the lug change was somewhere between 35327 and 36131? Nope! Cleveland #37819 had B&B's!)

Highest Cleveland label observed- #61149

Lowest Holiday with speckled interior- #88308

Still working on narrowing down the changes in other hardware (tone control pads, lug screws and washers, machined vs. cast collet noses, etc). I don't do any of this tracking for dating purposes; I do it just for restoration purposes so I know what hardware I should put on bare, orphan shells.

Sorry for such an extended post, but please, if anyone has similar pinpointing of Rogers changes, let me know.

Mike

My 1966 BR Headliner kit is a classic example that you can't always date a drum by the hardware. The bass drum SHOULD have bowtie T-rods and matching claws, but have the newer T-rods and claws. Both toms SHOULD have square-head tension rods, but have tension rods with the little "blips". All drums have Cleveland tags as follows:

31253 8x12 Cleveland – Holiday

52096 16x16 Cleveland – Holiday

57938 14x20 Cleveland – Holiday

Is it possible that my shells somehow never became a "kit" while in Covington and ended up in the move to Dayton? I guess anything is possible. The bottom line is that I LOVE this kit!

-Mark

Mark,

Your set (if factory-original) is a perfect example of all the strange anomalies we see on Rogers drums of this period, but the oddest thing on your set is that 8x12. That 1963 8x12 shell with Cleveland Holiday tag #31253 should have B&B lugs. If those Beavertails are factory-installed original lugs, that's the lowest Holiday number with Beavertails I've seen. Is it possible to post a shot of the label? Any chance that 8x12 has been re-drilled for Beavertails? Just curious.

Mike

Hey Guys,

Are the Bowtie Rogers BD T-rods the same as a "Faucet Handle"/WFL type?

I only know the Dayton ones.

Anyone have a pic of a Rogers Bowtie BD T-rod.

Thanks, just wondering.

Yes, the "bow tie" tension rods are the same as the "faucet" rods. I suppose they do look more like a faucet handle than a bow tie!

I know there were at least two different claw designs as well. These are the claws typically found with the bow tie/faucet T-rods. I'm not sure if there was a transition period were the new claws might've been used with bow ties rods or if the new (curved, flat handle) T-rods could be found with these claws. As the years have gone by I'm sure some parts have been interchanged.

The whole thing has turned into a maze of information and details of oddity when it comes to Rogers drums. We do seem to have come down to the point where, if these were cars, we'd be wondering if the tires are original on a 1967 Mustang - probably not. I do like Mark idrum4fun's comment at this juncture:

"The bottom line is that I LOVE this kit!"

That's where I'm headed nowadays. The details are making me dizzy. Help2