From Rob Cook's Ludwig Book

New Yorker Outfit (1959-1966)

5x14 supa (not called a supra when this outfit started)

8x12 tom

12x22 bass

The 12x20 bass drums went with the Hobby outfit, which also had the 3x13 snare. And the 4x14 snare went with the earlier Downbeat outfits.

So I'm completely confused by what you have there, even given the postage stamp pics you attached in the second thread.

according to the drum cat of 67 the new yorker which i have in silver spark is a 14x20 kick 8x12 hanger after 65/66 they came with the supra they say same as the down beat outfit minus the 14 x14 speaking of ,wtb a silver 14x 14 floor to make mine a down beat when i want it any one have one i know it will cost me

i wonder if at least the same pics can come out bigger

a couple things im confused about.my bass drum spurs are (L arm style) with small ludwig scripts on them as is my 12 in tom mount.the other new yorkers appear to have the square style mount with a steel square plate on the side of the tom.again no serial number on bass and 12 tt.pics coming ,please advise of best spots and areas of drums to photograph.

does anyone think ludwig did custom orders during the pre serial era??as i mentioned there is a stamp from a music studio inside the 22 ,12,14

ok i saw on another thread that my style of bass drum spur was intro in 1962 to replace the gullwing style that folded and were possibly problematic.so that puts my drums between 62-64 and the floor being april 1964 due to the low serial #,wow this research is engulfing me,is this the start of an addiction????....

oh yea that 16 shell is in great shape ,no badge but stamped 68 ,make a great re wrap ive seen others here and there w orange spray paint in them

I'm not familiar with any shells spray painted orange inside so that's a new one on me. It looks like it is mostly the re-ring area which was orange and not painted evenly all the way across.

I see a red felt "baseball bat" muffler on a tom and that plus pre serial both point to 61-63. I've got a date stamped 1963 snare with the red muffler. But by the red felt muffler days the insides were painted white. Like this

[img]http://black.net.nz/drums/nov18_1963.jpg[/img]

although from what I've heard the white paint could look different (from pale chalky through to more dense like what is in mine). The inside of the bass drum looks to me like maybe it was white and somebody sanded it so there isn't much white left. You might be able to see the traces up underneath where the re-ring meets the main shell. But that's getting a bit forensic x-mas3

As to special orders: yes. Plus the outfits which are named in the catalogs are just that: particular combinations of drums which are purchased as a named catalog outfit. The years of catalog production don't line up exactly with when some outfit was first introduced or last produced. And in some cases if you look really closely you can see that a photographer had to carefully turn badges away from the camera because they were no longer the current ones. So the catalogs offer guidance on what to expect, but the more you look the more exceptions you find.

And yes, it may become an obsession. Hold on to your wallet. Mind Blowi

Bass drum sizes changed on the New Yorker through the years............

Like the changes of sizes of the Club Date Outfits.........