Your shell looks like 6ply to me now that I have a very good look at this photo. I am not experienced in how to sort out numbers of plys and how all that works.
Very good to see your drum! That makes two Gretsch 1940's 6ply drums out there that we know about. I wonder how many more will turn up.
This is getting interesting.
skapunk: That really came out beautifully! Do you have a thread here showing your refinish process? I'm curious if you took any pics of the drum without the throw, or of the throw when it was off the drum. I believe my drum originally had the same throw yours does; when I got it the drum was complete except for the throw. I found the later 4 point throw fits the bolt pattern so that is what I have mounted on there now. It's nickle like the rest of the hardware so matches pretty well. I would love to find an original throw like yours - but think that is very unlikely.
oddball: It's good to know the drum shop is still in business. There are very few of the old drum stores anymore - even Jack's in Boston is gone (though one of the owners opened a small shop on the Cape where he retired to, so I guess it's not completely gone).
Kona: I'm sorry - I know the pics I posted are hard to see, but it was the best I could do. I think its really hard when the plies are all the same type of wood (versus the maple-poplar-maple that was used in later drums and is much easier to see). Did that snare shell in your pics come without any hardware? What type of a throw does/did it take? And what is the thickness of the floor tom you have - is it the same thickness as these snares?
Member Potsy24 walked me through the process. Here is a link to his instructionshttp://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=23265&page=2
I am not sure I documented the refinishing process of this one but here are some more before pics:
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/GretschStandardBroadcasterSnare001.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/GretschStandardBroadcasterSnare002.jpg[/IMG]
Here is what the same finishing process did for an old leedy utility I restored.
Before:
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/LeedyUtilitySnarePic001.jpg[/IMG]
After:
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/1940LeedyUtilitySnareBadgeShot.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/1940LeedyUtilitySnareStrainerShot.jpg[/IMG]
Your results are going to depend largely on what the drum and grain look like underneath that paint.
My guess is that it will be similar to my maple Gretsch that was born in 48
Did find a couple interior pics. Not the greatest but here ya go!
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/GretschStandardBroadcasterSnare004_zpse32d984c.jpg[/IMG]
[IMG]http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i292/skapunk_edge/GretschStandardBroadcasterSnare005_zps7f8d28f3.jpg[/IMG]
The snare came complete and it was pretty much in the condition you see in my photo. It was hard to believe it was a Factory finish...not altered....but there was NO trace of that being the case...that I could tell anyway. The Strainer looks like the regular BroadKaster you see in the 46 Catalog on the Seperate Tension 6 1/2x14 snare drum. I don't know if my drum is a 46 but I'm guessing anywhere from there to 49. It puzzles me that it has a natural finish though because I haven't seen it offered in the 40's catalogs....so far. But Gretsch did a lot of special orders...they also did not list all their finishes all the time from what I've been able to find out. Shell thicknes: It's thick, I will pull the head off sometime and measure it. It's stamped Gretsch Super Structure inside and from my edge photo it looks like a 4 ply shell but not 6 and not 3.
Kona: I'm sorry - I know the pics I posted are hard to see, but it was the best I could do. I think its really hard when the plies are all the same type of wood (versus the maple-poplar-maple that was used in later drums and is much easier to see). Did that snare shell in your pics come without any hardware? What type of a throw does/did it take? And what is the thickness of the floor tom you have - is it the same thickness as these snares?
The snare came complete and it was pretty much in the condition you see in my photo. It was hard to believe it was a Factory finish...not altered....but there was NO trace of that being the case...that I could tell anyway. The Strainer looks like the regular BroadKaster you see in the 46 Catalog on the Seperate Tension 6 1/2x14 snare drum.
I don't have a 1946 catalog and can't find one online. Do you have a picture of your drum with the strainer on it and not just the stripped shell? Or can you compare the strainer to one of the catalogs that is online (at vintagedrumguide.com or gretschdrums.com) or the drums in this thread - is it the same as my drum in the 4th picture or skapunk's 3rd picture or different from both? Does it have three or four bolts?
I would guess that your drum was refinished after having the paint stripped off by a previous owner. The early Gretsch wood drums I've seen were all with walnut veneer - not maple which was under all the wrapped and painted drums. One way you might be able to tell would be to figure out what kind of a finish is on top of the maple. Testing with different solvents may do the trick (if you care). Polyurethane, for example, would have to be a modern finish.
I have part of the 46 Catalog. I was looking at so many photos and catalogs in different places today and I saw a 40's Grestch 6.5x14 snare drum with the exact same Strainer that's on my drum....and the drum in the post above...but do you think I can find it...no! I'm sure I saved it but it's not anywhere to be found. It does not look like the one in the 1941 online catalog.
I could test the drum to see if it's lacquer (lacquer will come off very easy with Acetone)...test it in a small area under a lug. But man, this finish looks Factory....no funny stuff under the lugs and the badge seems to not have been tampered with at all. It would be very difficult to get a finish like this without removing the badge....the finish at the edges of the badge does not like it was applied with the badge on.
Personally I would love to remove the finish because I could then stain the drum to match my rack to and bass drum. But I don't want to do that if it is indeed a factory finish.......it's a tough one. And...on top of that....I searched high and low for a 40's floor tom...and finally found one in Milwaukee USA. It looked like the perfect drum to refinish and match the tom and bass drum because the finish has lots of damage = no guilt in removing it. Well.....it turned out to be a 6ply (the drum at the link to the thread in the first post here). I may just leave it.
I don't have a 1946 catalog and can't find one online. Do you have a picture of your drum with the strainer on it and not just the stripped shell? Or can you compare the strainer to one of the catalogs that is online (at vintagedrumguide.com or gretschdrums.com) or the drums in this thread - is it the same as my drum in the 4th picture or skapunk's 3rd picture or different from both? Does it have three or four bolts?I would guess that your drum was refinished after having the paint stripped off by a previous owner. The early Gretsch wood drums I've seen were all with walnut veneer - not maple which was under all the wrapped and painted drums. One way you might be able to tell would be to figure out what kind of a finish is on top of the maple. Testing with different solvents may do the trick (if you care). Polyurethane, for example, would have to be a modern finish.
Thanks for the pic of your drum. If you saw a strainer like that in a 46 catalog then I guess they were using this throw as well as the one skapunk showed back in the 40's - I thought the one you show on your drum was more of a 50's part but I'm glad to know otherwise.
How is the badges on your snare held on - at least some of the 40's snare badges are held on with press fit grommits - no crimping. If it is press fit badge on your drum then it would be easy to remove and put back on without any visible damage (similar to the round badge bass drum grommits - also press fit).
You may never be sure if your drum has original finish. I'm doubtful since I haven't seen any original Gretsch drums that old with varnish finished maple, but there's lots I haven't seen. One original example would prove me wrong. The only way I can think to test is to try a bunch of solvents (including goof-off which is a latex solvent) on your drum and an old walnut marching snare. They should behave the same if your finish is old. I would also expect some finish damage (scratches, checking) if your snare was original, but none under the lugs - things like that.
No - sorry - I didn't see it in a '46' catalog - was mistaken....it is in the 48 catalog - front page - here:
http://www.drumarchive.com/Gretsch/Gretsch_48.pdf
I have suspicions about the finish too. I will have to take a closer look. If I do come to the conclussion that it is NOT a Factory finish I will be very happy because I will remove it and it will be Stained Burnt Orange-like the same as the rest of the kit. And - I did remove that very badly damaged wrap on my 47 Gretsch floor tom today. Man what a job! The wrap came off relatively easy but that cloth material Gretsch used to bind the wrap to the shell is murder to remove! They certainly did not want someone like Art Blakey for instance to 'lose his wrap' in the middle of A Night In Tunisia haha. I've sanded for a good 4-5 hours today and I still got more to go. The wood looks good under there though.
Sorry to get off topic but I thought you and others might be interested in the cloth wrap story. I may start a Thread showing before during and after the process. It's good to know what you might run into under some of these old wraps.
I'll let you know about the grommet later.
gary
Thanks for the pic of your drum. If you saw a strainer like that in a 46 catalog then I guess they were using this throw as well as the one skapunk showed back in the 40's - I thought the one you show on your drum was more of a 50's part but I'm glad to know otherwise.How is the badges on your snare held on - at least some of the 40's snare badges are held on with press fit grommits - no crimping. If it is press fit badge on your drum then it would be easy to remove and put back on without any visible damage (similar to the round badge bass drum grommits - also press fit).You may never be sure if your drum has original finish. I'm doubtful since I haven't seen any original Gretsch drums that old with varnish finished maple, but there's lots I haven't seen. One original example would prove me wrong. The only way I can think to test is to try a bunch of solvents (including goof-off which is a latex solvent) on your drum and an old walnut marching snare. They should behave the same if your finish is old. I would also expect some finish damage (scratches, checking) if your snare was original, but none under the lugs - things like that.
Here is my 40's...
