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How many Vintage drums exist? Last viewed: 1 hour ago

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Here is a question that would be hard to answer. Let’s take Ludwig, Rogers and Slingerland alone and think about how many drum sets were produced. Let’s say between 1950 and 1980, 30 years of the big three building the drums that we all crave for. How many of these vintage drums survived the years without getting destroyed by fire or floods or whatever. Or just plain ole thrown in the garbage.

I write/ask this because now that I am addicted to the sport of hunting down drums (sport?) and bringing them home, I wonder just how many are still out there and where are they. Will we be able to continue to find these vintage drums? Obviously the newer ones will be easier to find.

I find it very enjoyable to drive to that unknown seller’s house to check out what he really has, licking my chops the entire way there. My problem is once I get them home and cleaned up, I can’t let them go. Which brings up another question, how much will the value of my drums increase over the next 15 /20 years? I am telling my wife that this is part of my retirement plan,lol. But is it an investment or will they be pretty much worth what I paid today? I can’t sell them but want to keep accumulating them also.

Oh well, what do you guys think? I was just wondering and needed something to do while my wife gets ready to go out for breakfast. She has four cats to feed, lol.

Jeff C


Thank you!
Jeff C

"Enjoy every sandwich" Warren Zevon
Posted on 12 years ago
#1
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JC,

That is a very interesting question. I too have wondered about the pool of available vintage drums. The sad truth is that;

A.) unless there is a marked shift in the nature of the market, I do not see vintage drums appreciating in value all that much. On the other hand, the mint condition drums for the first part of the 20th century do seem to command some high prices, but only to a small handful of buyers. When I say "marked shift" I mean that the market would have to start valuing drum kits like vintage guitars and I just don't see that happening. I also don't see that happening with our current economy that shows absolutely no signs of improving and will most likely get worse.

B.) While quite morbid it is also true that as guys like us pass on, our collections will be parted out or sold in estate sales thus perpetuating the available stock as it were.

It will be interesting to see what others think.

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 12 years ago
#2
Posts: 1427 Threads: 66
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I collect vintage freestyle bikes (from 80-90 time frame) as well and this is a similar problem.

Believe it or not, NOS stuff still comes up. I have a 1984 Haro FST frame in red, still in the original packaging! Also an NOS 1986 Haro Master (but it has been unwrapped)

I have not seen any NOS drum kits ever (yet) that old, but in both cases there were a lot of them! As the original owners get older (or worse) I think some of these kits will become available if the rest of the family is not interested...

Cobalt Blue Yamaha Recording Custom 20b-22b-8-10-12-13-15-16f-18f
Red Ripple '70's Yamaha D-20 20b-12-14f
Piano Black Yamaha Recording Custom Be-Bop kit 18b-10-14f
Snares:
Yamaha COS SDM5; Yamaha Cobalt Blue RC 5-1/2x14; Gretsch round badge WMP; 1972 Ludwig Acrolite; 1978 Ludwig Super Sensitive; Cobalt Blue one-off Montineri; Yamaha Musashi 6.5X13 Oak; cheap 3.5X13 brass piccolo
Posted on 12 years ago
#3
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There are drums from every maker, as well as periods of production which will be more valuable, and sustain value better than others. Rarity and quality do influence value in varying proportions.

I hope to see values return, and I hope to see the economy get better, but I have my doubts. I think we are doomed.

Eventually, my collection will be sold off. If I live long enough, perhaps even by myself. Most likely not. But, I am hoping to at least have enough information on hand the collection can be liquidated without getting ripped off.

I also think the pool of vintage drums is not unlimited. There will always be a significant stockpile circulating, with pieces passing from hand to hand. There will always be the occasional ***el popping out of the woodwork. However, I also believe that the proliferation of drum strippers at work today are damaging the overall vintage drum scene. Some very unique perfectly good, highly collectable, and valuable drums have already been destroyed, or at the very least.... they exist now as a forced restoration. The only known to exist Aluminum shelled Rogers Powertone is a prime example. The drum was purchased, stripped, sold as parts, and whoever ended up with the shell, was forced to restore a unique piece using unoriginal period parts. That hurts all of us. At some point, the overall quality of the vintage drum pool is going to be irreparably harmed by greed. And if a vintage drum is nothing more than a collection of vintage period parts, well, they never were that valuable to begin with. I so hope that is not true. But I do fear a "parts is parts" mentality is running rampant, and it will harm every one of us. Dont buy from strippers.

Rogers Drums Big R era 1975-1984 Dating Guide.
http://www.vintagedrumforum.com/showthread.php?t=24048
Posted on 12 years ago
#4
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Ploughman,

Those are all great points. I too thing that the stripping for parts mentality is seriously damaging the availble resource so to speak. Your comment about vintage drums not being that valuable in the first place is pretty spot on sadly. If those drums had the requisite fiscal value in the first place, there would be no need to strip for profit. Of course, once a seller starts piecing out their acquisitions there is no doubt that they will inadvertantly piece out something of serious value like the aforementioned Rogers snare drum.

Regardless, it is what it is and I suppose we can at least be encouraged that our hobby is nowhere near as expensive as many other potential pastimes!

tnsquint
Very proud owner of a new Blaemire Snare 6.5 x 14 made by Jerry Jenkins "Drumjinx"
Posted on 12 years ago
#5
Posts: 1427 Threads: 66
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I don't like to support the strippers (well, DRUM strippers anyway :p) but in some cases, you may need that one part to get your project back on-line without resorting to drilling additional holes to fit the wrong strainer for example...

A lot of nice, rare vintage cars suffered the same fate in the 80's. Cars thought to be 'too far gone' were parted out. Now, cars in worse condition are restored, for the reasons you sited- the original pan, and as much of the 'as-delivered' sheet metal is in tact.

It truly is a double edged sword, and I think, based on your aluminum Rogers example, The drum strippers are so focused on the margin on loose parts they miss something significant like that. (I wonder what that aluminum drum sounds like??)

Cobalt Blue Yamaha Recording Custom 20b-22b-8-10-12-13-15-16f-18f
Red Ripple '70's Yamaha D-20 20b-12-14f
Piano Black Yamaha Recording Custom Be-Bop kit 18b-10-14f
Snares:
Yamaha COS SDM5; Yamaha Cobalt Blue RC 5-1/2x14; Gretsch round badge WMP; 1972 Ludwig Acrolite; 1978 Ludwig Super Sensitive; Cobalt Blue one-off Montineri; Yamaha Musashi 6.5X13 Oak; cheap 3.5X13 brass piccolo
Posted on 12 years ago
#6
Posts: 1971 Threads: 249
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Don't know exactly to how to word this so it will be a bit clumsy but... I wonder what impact the change of technology of drumming will eventually have on the collecting of vintage drums sets.

When the skill to use something disappears the motivation to collect them might disappear to... they just become odd decorations until they disappear.

Percussion tracks are produced so easily without drums now....

I have worked in the technology field for over 30 years and when I think back on the tools, skills, devices, systems, just all kinds of things in my weird super accelerated business that nobody thought we could ever survive without that have just disappeared... well you just don't have confidence that anything, no matter how important it seemed will not slide into obscurity.

The young, brilliant and talented people the I hire now do their work completely differently than we did when I started... and that old stuff is of no remote value because the purpose it served isn't even really understood.

Ok very clumsy! But some day does "drumming" maybe even the idea, appreciation and value of beating on something with sticks to produces music rhythms disappear and get replaced by something so different that traditional drumming just seems weird and useless to have around.Toilet

But not for at least one more generation... http://www.videorolls.com/watch/10-year-old-girl-is-amazing-on-drums

Not a Guru... just interested..
Posted on 12 years ago
#7
Posts: 5227 Threads: 555
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From jccabinets

Here is a question that would be hard to answer. Let’s take Ludwig, Rogers and Slingerland alone and think about how many drum sets were produced. Let’s say between 1950 and 1980, 30 years of the big three building the drums that we all crave for. How many of these vintage drums survived the years without getting destroyed by fire or floods or whatever. Or just plain ole thrown in the garbage.I write/ask this because now that I am addicted to the sport of hunting down drums (sport?) and bringing them home, I wonder just how many are still out there and where are they. Will we be able to continue to find these vintage drums? Obviously the newer ones will be easier to find.I find it very enjoyable to drive to that unknown seller’s house to check out what he really has, licking my chops the entire way there. My problem is once I get them home and cleaned up, I can’t let them go. Which brings up another question, how much will the value of my drums increase over the next 15 /20 years? I am telling my wife that this is part of my retirement plan,lol. But is it an investment or will they be pretty much worth what I paid today? I can’t sell them but want to keep accumulating them also.Oh well, what do you guys think? I was just wondering and needed something to do while my wife gets ready to go out for breakfast. She has four cats to feed, lol.Jeff C

Jeff,Great question's you asked.This is what i think over the years i have been thinking how many drums were made,what happen to them ete..The best i can tell i would think their is more snare drum's than set's made and sold because when most drummer's are statring out the first drum is always a snare than the set comes...This is why i think many more snare's are out their than set's..As far as value in 15 to 20 years,i think it will be more than what someone has paid for the drum's. The way i look at it is back in the 80's you could pick up a nice set of 60's vintage Ludwig's ete for 200.00-300.00 a set today these same sets sell for 1,000.00 to 3,500.00+.I know this for a fact i picked up a set of 70's Ludwig it was a Jazzette set up 18,12,14,14 i paid 200.00 for it in 1989..I sold that same set in 2010 for 4,000.00.....Mikey

Posted on 12 years ago
#8
Posts: 1071 Threads: 128
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I don't like to support the strippers (well, DRUM strippers anyway :p) but in some cases, you may need that one part to get your project back on-line without resorting to drilling additional holes to fit the wrong strainer for example...A lot of nice, rare vintage cars suffered the same fate in the 80's. Cars thought to be 'too far gone' were parted out. Now, cars in worse condition are restored, for the reasons you sited- the original pan, and as much of the 'as-delivered' sheet metal is in tact.It truly is a double edged sword, and I think, based on your aluminum Rogers example, The drum strippers are so focused on the margin on loose parts they miss something significant like that. (I wonder what that aluminum drum sounds like??)

I do like your point on not suporting drum strippers , well at least not the bad ones.

I agree it's better to get that much needed part and finish one drum to spec rather than to have your classic drum with new holes or put on parts just because they will fit and never never be 100% happy with it in the end.

I do sell parts from time to time from classic toms lugs , bass , hardware ect just because the drum is so far gone to bring it back to it's original state and just not worth spending any kind of good money on a drum that will sit for no good reason while the parts can be used for you or the guy down the street , To me that is responsible drum stripping , NOT LIKE LEE COUNTY THOSE MF'S they will rip apart a mint camco/gretsch kit just to sell you a 10$ washer that you can get a home depot . I think the good can be found in some responsible used vintage drum parts dealers who under stand when it's time to strip a VINTAGE DRUM .

80's 13 pc sonor signature
1979 12 pc ludwig power factory
Posted on 12 years ago
#9
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From MIKEY777

Jeff,Great question's you asked.This is what i think over the years i have been thinking how many drums were made,what happen to them ete..The best i can tell i would think their is more snare drum's than set's made and sold because when most drummer's are statring out the first drum is always a snare than the set comes...This is why i think many more snare's are out their than set's..As far as value in 15 to 20 years,i think it will be more than what someone has paid for the drum's. The way i look at it is back in the 80's you could pick up a nice set of 60's vintage Ludwig's ete for 200.00-300.00 a set today these same sets sell for 1,000.00 to 3,500.00+.I know this for a fact i picked up a set of 70's Ludwig it was a Jazzette set up 18,12,14,14 i paid 200.00 for it in 1989..I sold that same set in 2010 for 4,000.00.....Mikey

Mikey, good answer. I know its impossible to know how many drums were made but you for one would know how the value has changed over the years.

As far as drum stripping goes, ya its bad, and good. I can’t say much more to add to that topic.

I do have faith in our economy, It won’t get worse, it will get better. Every one just needs to be honest like me and pay there taxes, simple.

I will continue to hunt for drums and watch my collection grow. But my family will know better than to sell my drums at a yard sale or an estate sale. They know what they are worth. Besides, the plan is this,,,, I continue to have fun hunting, buying and restoring vintage drum sets and snares for the next fifteen years(I will be 65 years old). I have done this for two years and have collected 13 sets and a handful of Acros. So let’s say I accumulate 5 kits a year. In 15 years I will have 75 drum sets. Sell then for an average of 300 each,, $22,500.00. Of course it would be hard to sell 75 drum at once so I don’t know how that will go. Its all just an excuse to keep buying drums and keep them. Sounds fun huh!

Jeff C


Thank you!
Jeff C

"Enjoy every sandwich" Warren Zevon
Posted on 12 years ago
#10
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