So you are saying this forum is actually about wine? Or you saying the VINTAGE drum forum is aggrandizing nonsense? Do you know what the word aggrandizing means?

Royal Ace. Our dictionary is constantly changing not only because of new words but also as a result of the "current" use of an existing word. According to your argument above the only definition is the original definition, then the word "groovy" means containing grooves, the word "cool" refers only to temperature, and a hot girlfriend is a Woman with a fever.

It has been discussed several times in this and other posts that the word vintage had it's origination in the wine industry but we are discussing it with reference to DRUMS! A current use of the word and the title of this forum.

Currently people are using the word Vintage to mean a variety of things of things and it would be nice to know what is meant. That's all. I don't think anyone on this forum is talking about wine.

Although my drums are like a fine wine!

The word 'vintage' certainly does not refer only to the year a given wine was produced. Maybe that was it's origin, but it has evolved to a much larger meaning in the world of objects that are historic, collectible, important, significant or otherwise desireable.

The use of the term 'vintage' is very subjective. It's meaning varies from person to person: there are no hard and fast rules to define the term. As we can see from this 14-page thread that goes back almost 4 years, the debate is endless since everyone applies a different meaning to it. Personal preferences and prejudices have an impact on what a person views to be 'vintage' and those impressions cannot be defined away.

Excellent Points!

I agree for the most part. But….aye here's the rub….even though we have several very subjective uses for the word, shouldn't WE (vintage drum forum people) at the very least have an agreed upon definition? Even if we have several variations, like Vintage and vintage or Vintage I, Vintage II, Vintage III???

Wouldn't something like that make sense? By some folks definition my 90's Yammies are vintage, yet when I have talked about them on this forum I have been slammed by some people for talking about non-vintage drums.

If it's up to each to have his/her own subjective definition then what is this forum all about? Anything called a drum could be considered vintage by someone. Correct?

Question? Just realized that it's spring of 2004 and my Yamaha Maple Custom set was produced around the spring of '94 at least according to the nice person at Yamaha that I emailed several times.

Does this mean they are VINTAGE???? Yes? Maybe? Sort-of? Somewhat?

They are vintage mid-90's Yamahas. Shunned by some, collectible to others.

But in the generally accepted sense, they are not 'vintage' for the purposes of this forum. IMHO.

I think we can all agree that 70's or earlier drums are 'vintage' to most people. And for some folks, the 80's era is in there as well (especially if we're talking the last of the Rogers USA drums).

Once you get later than that, the term doesn't apply for most observers.

Of course, to some 16-year-old kid born in 1998, drums from 1994 are OLD..... ;)

An example from my own life:

In 1966, I was 16. That summer I bought my first car: a 1956 Olds 88 coupe. The car was only 10 years old, but to me it was OLD. Compared to what was in the showrooms that year, it was a mastodon.

So the meaning of vintage does shift depending on the vintage of the observer....

(By the way, the car was in good shape, and cost me only $40! I sold it a while later for $60! From that point on, I was hooked on buying/trading/swapping for fun and profit...)

The Oxford Dictionary has some definitions of Vintage....the first being the year that a high quality of wine was produced. Down in 2nd place is a definition that might apply to the way we use it:

Denoting something from the past of high quality, especially something representing the best of its kind

Only catch I see with that def. is that it can apply to this afternoon. If something of quality was produced today or yesterday, etc.

Ya - I went back and looked again - the better example on the Oxford Dictionary page is what I changed (edited) to above.